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Looking for joy? Then it might be worth exploring your sorrow, complications and mess. In his latest collection of essays, Inciting Joy, poet Ross Gay reconsiders the breadth of joy, arguing that it can be found – and even strengthened – in life's hardest moments, when we must rely on one another. This week, host Brittany Luse sits down with Gay to discuss the complexity of joy, the beauty of grace and creating meaning in life.

Learn more about "Catalog,” the first track of Jagjaguwar’s newly released 25th anniversary record “Dilate Your Heart.” Set against a shimmering soundscape by Bon Iver, Gay performs the titular poem from his widely-lauded 2015 book.

"In these dark, combative times, we attempt the most radical counter programming we could imagine: a show made up entirely of stories about delight." Join Bim in the podcast episode titled "The Job of Delight" where they talk to poet Ross Gay about the discipline and rigor of seeking and holding onto delight